Sunak (General U.K. is Jaded thread)

mono-stereo

In all seriousness we should probably just drop Trident and make sure multinationals pay a fair share of tax. Keeping the NHS free at the point of use is a cornerstone of British life and should be protected for as long as we possibly can.

C_J

I think a lot of people would agree with that mono. A lot of reasonable, intelligent people.

My personal view is that we need trident, even though it’s crazily expensive. I think it’s a relevant factor in our security. I will also admit that I’m not really an expert on this and I’m only about 60 - 70% confident on that view.

The NHS being free at the point of use is, I think, clearly not a viable option now unfortunately. I don’t think that’s controversial. It’s a relic from a different era, albeit a proud one.

The point about Americans being unhealthy despite facing high healthcare costs is a fair one. My underlying point is that we all benefit if we can make unhealthy, risky behaviour expensive and healthy stuff cheap. Can we at least agree on that as a goal? There must surely be something we can reach a consensus on! My heart breaks every time I see a 12 year old sumo spilling out of her size 24 jeggings as she queues for battered fare with her rippling parents smoking away. The sums simply don’t add up!

alistair

C_J if income was taxed here at a similar level as America it might be more palatable. Even Rachel Reeves is wincing

https://mol.im/a/12931891

Amps

C_J The NHS being free at the point of use is, I think, clearly not a viable option now unfortunately. I don’t think that’s controversial. It’s a relic from a different era, albeit a proud one.

You could say the same about Man City or Wrexham. But, wow, once they are properly funded, and properly run by people who are invested in the outcome, they appear to be ‘fit for purpose’. Who knew! As far as I know, turning around the fortunes of these businesses / institutions wasn’t too difficult either.

Smallman1

Live. Love. Laugh.

Do that and this wonderful thing called life will be all gravy baby!

whatever

Amps

And something that hasn’t had to deal with successive years of defunding, and round after round of workforce reorganisation and restructures as a result.

C_J

Amps Man City’s annual operating costs would run the NHS until about lunchtime on the 3rd of January each year.

C_J

whatever defunding

🤣

Amps

C_J Not the point, just whataboutery as you’re losing the argument.

ehitach2

But would the surgeons be wearing these?

Mad_Cyril

Amps
That started when he wrote the first post

C_J

Amps the NHS can’t be funded under the current model going forwards. It’s not up for dispute, it’s just maths. No one is arguing about that.

And “whataboutery” is when you deflect attention from the original topic by bringing up other issues. You’re saying “if Man City can be turned around by rich people why can’t the NHS?” and I’m pointing out that the NHS is so expensive that not even the Arabs could run it: the annual cost of the NHS is about the same as the entire GDP of the United Arab Emirates!

Amps

C_J It’s not up for dispute, it’s just maths. No one is arguing about that.

I fuckin am. It has been run successfully for a very long time, it’s only the underfunding and capitalist attitudes of more recent governments that have fucked it. Remove the internal market from it, bullshit £10,000 doors and the like, have it managed by a government who give a shit and don’t want to asset strip the country, and I’m sure it will do just fine!

whatever

C_J

You think the Government didn’t do that by reducing funding to the NHS year on year?

C_J

whatever oh come off it mate!

whatever

C_J

I worked with the healthcare sector and saw it first hand. I worked directly with the managers cutting back services, closing treatment centres etc. all the while being softened up for the steady drip of privatisation. The NHS was running at a deficit of something like £40-50bn at one point. The funding did increase at points, but by the time it did, the deficit was so great that it was never able to catch up.

Old-Dutch

Amps . Remove the internal market from it, bullshit £10,000 doors and the like

This is exactly the same in the University sector by the way. Completely boiled my piss the extent of the wasted money that goes towards simple Estates projects

Dubman

I work in logistics and the amount of money the NHS pays to private contractors is frightening. A few weeks ago I took one small box from Worthing hospital to Brighton hospital. Got paid £40 but the company I worked for charged them much more.

C_J

Dubman I work in logistics and the amount of money the NHS pays to private contractors is frightening. A few weeks ago I took one small box from Worthing hospital to Brighton hospital. Got paid £40 but the company I worked for charged them much more.

and that’s a perfect example of why the NHS is shit. Your employer wouldn’t be able to rip off a private business like this because they’d find a cheaper supplied of logistics (or go bust). The NHS, on the other hand, has enormous purchasing power yet will always pay as much as possible for stuff.

Why? Because if they don’t use up all their budgets and then some, they can’t claim they’ve run out of cash and demand more with all the usual stories of being overwhelmed and underfunded each winter.

Old-Dutch

The NHS should take control of all of their own car parks imo. Run them as an organisation and funnel the money back into the service.

Millsy

Old-Dutch this would wipe out the NHS funding gap overnight. The price of the cunts.

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