the production thread
Think Iāll spend some quality time this week with pigments working on sound design. The update looks interesting. Iāve been starting everything on hardware the last few months, maybe time to change it up.
Unbroken1 Itās really deep. Iāve used it, almost more as a sample processor than anything else, but havenāt used it enough to really get to know it. I get the feeling like pigments could be all you need along with a daw for arrangement.
Havenāt tried the v collection, if I canāt make whatever I want with the gear I have, thereās a problem that isnāt going to be resolved by buying more synths. That said, I use the fx collection all the time. The space echo emulation is on everything I do. Iām impressed with the value arturia provides, most companies donāt offer this many (really good) free updates.
@303abuser user"#p277946 ā¦have referenced this here before, but always tried to avoid collecting too many VSTās to avoid the risk of spending more time tinkering than actually making anything, but desperately wanted a 303 plug-in and was sold on Acid V.
Basically the upgrade deal to V Collection was as much as Acid V at full price- effectively 38 synths free!
Yeah that makes sense. Iāve got the abl3 vet and a tb3, plus the syntakt, analog four, and dfam are all pretty capable of reproducing a decent 303 sound. Iāve been wanting to do an acid project for a while, maybe after the current album Iām working on is done.
Iāve found over time that if I take a week every once in a while and just do in the box sound design, that scratches the itch to just make noise. The patches and samples that come out of those session often end up being foundational for future tracks, so itās a win-win.
Unbroken1 Had the V Collection for some years now. Currently got V9 but didnāt go for the upgrade on account that I am rarely using VSTs these days for my main compositions. There are some lovely sounds through and I have probably used Arturia stuff more than NI or any other vendor over the years. They are pretty deep, but I found that in the end I only scratched the surface of the V Collection without really fully understanding how to properly manipulate the synths.
As for reliability. The only issue I have had is on my M1 Mac where the display would sometimes have screwed dials etc. I had a couple of tickets open on it with their support. Not used it for a while do I donāt know if itās fixed or not.
Pigments is a beast though. The new version had a new engine āModalā which is pretty sweetā¦.
303abuser ā¦Iāve yet to get my hardware properly integrated into my workflow, but really enjoy tinkering with it āofflineā, iāll get it happening sooner or later!
Henry ā¦actually think Iāve learned quite a bit in a short time with them, but obviously the parameters and quirks of nearly 40 VSTās take some getting your head around. Not encountered any issues with the MBP, actually donāt think an Arturia VST has glitched/frozen/crashed on me yet, unlike Diva, which sounds incredible, but is, ironically, a bit of a Divaā¦
Unbroken1 Matt Thomas has done some highly entertaining videos on some of the main Arturia synths that are worth checking out.
I had been holding out to buy Diva in the Black Friday deals, but they didnāt drop the price. Which was probably a good thing as I really do not need another virtual synth in my life.
Good intro here to the DX7:
Unbroken1 The best thing I did for my hardware set up was picking up the model 12 mixer. Iāve got all my synths wired in, a sub output on each channel that runs to the digitakt so I can sample any combination of inputs, 2 aux channels for the space echo pedal and the internal fx. I come up with a looped sequence that I like, track it out individually into ableton and arrange/process from there. I can do live takes for different sections, builds/breaks/etc.
Itās really made the workflow more fun. If I feel like just jamming out on hardware, I can. If I want to work hybrid or int he box, Iāve got those options too. Itās a lot to manage at the beginning, but itās so worth it once the workflow clicks.
303abuser I have been semi-curious about this. I have the āGolden Trinityā of DN-ST-DT in that order with the DT II as the final box in the chain. I have just started going through the very laborious process of recording my tracks into Ableton. And as you know that isnāt great as I am limited by not being able to route the ST and DN individually directly into Ableton. Nor can I have FX on each individual track. So I am currently recording individual tracks one at a time, and the novelty of that has worn thin very quickly.
The Model 12 looks good. But, I may be wrong here, is limited by having mostly mono channels. And itās a bit big, and would threaten to ruin the feng shui in the boudoir/post midlife-crisis retreat I have created.
I canāt seem to find a smaller mixer that would offer more stereo outs and be smaller. So I guess I am left with an option to use a sound card with multiple in/outs?
If you managed to read all that you have probably come to the conclusion that I havenāt got a clue. Which wouldnāt be entirely wrong.
Henry So I also kind of donāt have a clue, but Iāll try to stumble through this for you. And Iāll apologize in advance for the length.
The model 12 is just barely enough for what I need. I have it completely maxed out and donāt have my drumbrute or tb3 connected at the moment (forget that the drumbrute can output each track individually). I actually have the dt outputs running into the a4, then into one of the stereo inputs to save a channel. I have two other mono channels eaten up by the returns from the space echo pedal. If I had the budget and was looking for another mixer, Iād probably look at a much larger analog desk with more aux sends and all stereo inputs.
As for workflow, tracking to ableton is my least favorite part of the process. Iāve come to terms with it, but itās so bloody tedious. I usually record dry individual tracks one at a time and will record a wet version if the fx are integral to the sound design. If I have a reverb across several DT tracks for instance, I really just use that reverb as a reference for the sound Iām looking for and use a vest reverb in ableton to make it cohesive. I just find that easier. Another thing I really like to do with chords is to get the kick/bass/hat pattern going in ableton, then just record a long jam of the dub chords (wet with the space echo). Sometimes Iāll take long sections of that for an arrangement and other times Iāll chop it up and resample hits to create different textures, repitch for ear candy, add variation, etc.
The whole this is a bit of a pain in the ass, but thatās the charm of hardware. I really donāt worry much about timing or imperfections anymore. Iāve learned to embrace the messiness of it and I think it helps me to come up with grooves and textures I wouldnāt otherwise. Itās also really great for layering sounds and gluing them together. Whether thatās several tracks from one box or layering multiple synths for sound design.
Sorry, that was a lot. Did that even come close to helping?
303abuser No that is really helpful. Good to know that running the tracks dry into Ableton is a normal thing to do. Thatās essentially what I have been doing. Unless I like what I have done with the delay/reverb send in one of the boxes, and then Iāll just import that through the master channel.
I just didnāt want to go down another rabbit hole looking for a solution to something that there isnāt really a solution for without investing a lot of time, effort and money buying more gear.
Last night I was playing around, for the first time in probably a year, just with the DT and ST running through Overbridge into Ableton, and using Push on Pigments and really enjoying that workflow. So could well see that working for me.
You are right about getting the timings exactly right. Unless itās really obvious on the reference beats then itās good to be a bit messy and adds to the feel of it.
Great. There really isnāt a simple way to to just track everything out quickly. The more I use my hardware in early composition, the more I enjoy it though.
Iām way more loose with how I compose than I used to be and I think thatās a good thing. I used to be really obsessed with the grid and proper phrasing, now if it sounds good, I kind of donāt care. I think if I were writing specifically to be played by djs in clubs, it would be different. I really like swing, groove, and some randomness now. I think itās a matter of now that I understand the rules, I know when to break them and donāt worry about it.